How to Keep Releasing Music Without Burning Out (Leah Nawy)
Indie Pop artist Leah Nawy shares her journey from studying songwriting and production to releasing music independently as well as breaking down how storytelling, consistency, and self-belief shape her creative process. We also discuss release strategy including her latest single “Quicksand”.
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Transcript:
Mike:
Hey Leah, how are you?
Leah:
Hi, I am good. How are you?
Mike:
I’m doing good, thanks. Thank you so much for being on the show, I always appreciate it.
We were just chatting not too long ago, and sometimes that’s what happens — I get press releases all the time and I go through them and see artists that I really like, and I really connected with Quicksand.
I thought it was such a phenomenal single and definitely wanted to talk more about it.
But one of the things I noticed — and I want to start off with this — is that you talk quite a bit about storytelling.
And I wanted to know more about what that means to you, because storytelling can mean so many different things.
So specifically, what drew you to being a storyteller?
Leah:
Yeah, I mean I feel like along with being a musician, I’ve always just really been attracted to words and sentences and poetry, and just the emotions that can come from lyrics.
So I always say it depends on the musician.
For me, if the track is amazing but the lyrics aren’t hitting with me, I usually won’t gravitate toward that song.
Where some people are the complete opposite — they’re like, I could not care less what they’re saying.
And that doesn’t necessarily mean it has to be really deep or cerebral.
Even if it’s like “Hey call me maybe,” I’m like, yeah, that’s an awesome hook. It just has to hit properly.
So when I write, the songs that usually take off and continue always start with a few sentences, and then that’s the jumping off point for the lyrics and the story.
I’ll even write a whole verse and I don’t even know what the song’s about yet.
I’m just like, this feels good, this flows into this, and I try to hit that flow state to see what comes out.
Then I go back in and I’m like, okay, that’s what I’m going to craft around.
And then I find the meaning and the story underneath that.
Mike:
So you start with the music first, then develop the lyrics around it?
Or is it the other way around?
Leah:
It’ll usually start with sentences actually, but the sentences have melody in them.
Melody and lyrics usually happen at the same time.
For me it’s about the rhythm of the words.
The pattern of the sentence kind of informs the melody, and then from there I add the chords underneath.
As it pertains to storytelling, what usually happens is I don’t know exactly what it’s going to be about when I start.
But when I go back in, the story always ends up relating to my emotions and my life.
It’s not always something that literally happened to me, but it feels emotionally true.
Mike:
That makes a lot of sense.
So it sounds like it’s a very fluid process where one thing leads to another until you find the direction.
Are you the kind of person that writes a song start to finish in one sitting, or do you write pieces and come back to them later?
Leah:
Definitely the second.
Even if it’s not sitting for a long time, I rarely sit down and finish a whole song in one day.
Usually I write a section, then I come back to it later and keep adding to it.
Because there is that thing where you can’t just sit back and wait for inspiration.
It’s not like everything just flows through you magically.
I’ll come up with an idea, and then I have to do the work of going back and picking at it and figuring out how to develop it.
For example, the single before Quicksand, called Mixing Patterns, I wrote over like a year.
I was waiting for the bridge, and then finally something that felt right came.
So I keep coming back to things, but I don’t force it.
Mike:
Do you write every day, or do you set aside specific time to write?
Leah:
It depends.
Some months I’m writing every day and I have tons of ideas.
Then other months I haven’t written in three months.
And honestly, both are normal.
When I went to grad school for songwriting and production, I talked to professors about this.
There’s this misconception that if you’re not writing all the time, something is wrong.
But for a lot of people, including me, it comes in waves.
You’ll have months where you’re creating nonstop, and then months where you’re focused on visuals, shows, life, work, whatever.
That’s all part of the process.
Mike:
It sounds like writing and music have always been part of your life.
Was that something that started when you were a kid?
Leah:
Yes, definitely.
My dad is a musician as a hobby, so I grew up around pianos and guitars, and listening to Beatles records and Stevie Wonder and all that stuff.
I begged for piano lessons when I was like four or five.
My dad told me, if you’re serious, try to learn some things yourself first.
So I spent about a year just playing around on my own.
Then he was like, okay, she’s serious, let’s get her lessons.
And I’m really grateful for that, because it forced me to want it.
By the time I got lessons, I was already excited and ready.
Then when I was about twelve, I was like, okay, this is boring, I want to sing and be on stage.
So I started playing in rock bands at programs in Asbury Park on the Jersey Shore.
I was there like eight hours a week playing in Zeppelin cover bands and stuff like that.
Looking back now, that was the foundation for everything.
It taught me how to perform, how to play with other people, how to be in a band — all of it.
Mike:
I love that your dad made you figure things out first.
It’s almost like a test to see how serious you are.
Leah:
Totally.
And he always emphasized musicianship too.
He’d say, look at Alicia Keys, look at Lady Gaga — they sing, they play, they write.
Musicianship matters.
So I grew up understanding that really young.
Mike:
So when you got to the point where you were deciding to go to college — we’re jumping ahead a little bit here — you went to a number of music schools, including Berklee as well.
Can you talk a little bit about that?
I assume at this point you knew you wanted a career in music.
Leah:
Yes.
So I’ll go slightly before that.
In high school I’m doing the rock bands, and that’s when I start writing and bringing my own music to bands, and I’m really pushing my original songs.
I went to The New School for undergrad, and that was cool because it was a full performance degree.
It was all about bringing your musicianship up, bringing your performance skills up, learning how to get in front of people and improvise over something you’ve never heard before.
One of the biggest takeaways was learning how not to be embarrassed and just go for it.
So that was undergrad.
I was still writing a lot, still making music, but I realized something.
I had all these songs, but I didn’t know how to share them.
I didn’t know how to record them properly, I didn’t know how to make them tangible.
I could play them, but I felt like there was this block between writing the song and actually having something I could put out into the world.
So I spent an entire summer on Ableton, failing every day.
Midnight would hit and I’d be like, okay, you have to do this again tomorrow.
And I did that the whole summer.
Then I heard about the Berklee NYC master’s program, which was all songwriting and production, basically the opposite of my undergrad.
I didn’t even want to go back to school, but I went to the open house just to check it out.
And I fell in love with the whole thing.
We had to show songs every week, not just written, but produced.
Half a song every week, recorded, played in front of the class.
It forced me to finish things.
And by the end of the program, I had a five-song EP that I had written and produced myself.
Mike:
That’s incredible, and good for you for doing both — learning on your own and then getting formal education.
I love that you mentioned failing in Ableton every day, because that’s such a real thing.
You tried things yourself first, then you got structure from school.
You understood the practical side, and then you learned the higher concepts.
Leah:
Yeah, exactly.
When I first started recording, even just guitar and vocal, it was hard.
I would cry, I’d be like, I don’t know what I’m doing.
Then I got into the program and I was like, oh my God, I really don’t know what I’m doing.
How am I supposed to get through this?
But I realized production, songwriting, and mixing are all intertwined.
They all create the song.
You can write a song one way, but how you record it changes everything.
And I wanted to have the vocabulary to communicate with producers and mixers.
I wanted to be able to say what I wanted the song to sound like.
And the only way to do that was to learn it myself.
Mike:
I really like that you learned every part of the process — writing, performing, recording, producing.
Even if you don’t do everything yourself later, it helps you understand what everyone else is doing.
Leah:
Absolutely.
And I still collaborate all the time.
Just because I can produce doesn’t mean I always will.
There are people who are better than me at certain things, and I want to work with them.
But now I can go into a session and talk about reverb, or arrangement, or routing, and I can actually communicate what I want.
Producers appreciate that.
You don’t have to know everything, but you should know what you like and what you don’t like.
If you want a personal sound, you have to have opinions about your sound.
Mike:
So now you have all this experience, you know how to record, you know how to produce, you know how to write.
The next step is releasing music.
And that’s a big step, because uploading is easy, but getting people to hear it is not.
So talk about releasing your first single.
Leah:
Yeah…
I released my first single after graduating.
And I was terrified.
I feel like every artist thinks their first single has to represent everything about them.
Like this is who I am, this defines my sound, this has to be perfect.
And I was definitely in that mindset.
So I kept putting it off.
I kept tweaking things, not sure if it was ready.
Then one day I was at the dog park, just standing there, and I was like,
You know what? I just need to get dates on the calendar.
So in like 20 minutes, I set a release date, I set a photo shoot date, and I set a show date.
I reached out to friends, booked a gig, scheduled everything.
And once I did that, the decision was made.
It was happening.
All the fear about whether the song was good enough just went away.
And when the song came out, I realized something —
people want to support you.
At first it’s your friends, your family, your community.
But that’s how it starts.
And hearing people say they liked the song, even things I didn’t notice, made me realize…
this is actually fun.
I love sharing music.
Mike:
I love that story, because you planned everything in 20 minutes.
I’ve worked with artists for over 16 years, and I can tell you —
if you focus, you can plan a release in 20 minutes.
The details come later, but the plan can happen fast.
Leah:
Exactly.
And once you set the date, you just follow it.
You break things down step by step.
Send one email a day, do one task a day, and the ball starts rolling.
If you think about everything at once, it’s overwhelming.
You have to remember you’re supposed to enjoy this too.
Mike:
And it also depends what kind of release you want.
If you want a music video, a show, touring, promotion — that takes time.
If you just want to release a song, that’s simpler.
Both are fine, but you need realistic expectations.
Leah:
Exactly.
You can’t upload a song today and expect everything to happen tomorrow.
If you want to promote properly, everything needs to be done weeks in advance.
It’s actually better to give yourself more time, not less.
Set the big goal two months out, then work toward it week by week.
Sometimes you hit it, sometimes you don’t.
But every release teaches you something.
And every time you release something, it feels like starting over again.
Because you want to keep sharing what you make.
Mike:
That actually brings me to the next step, which is consistency, because that’s so important.
And I know from personal experience how difficult it can be to stay consistent, especially when you’re doing something creative.
I saw that you’ve been pretty consistent with releases, usually two or three singles a year.
So I’d love to know more about your process of staying consistent and being able to keep putting music out.
Leah:
Yeah, absolutely.
Honestly, I wish it was even more consistent.
I wish I could be on that four-to-five-week flow that some artists do.
But life happens, and everything comes and goes.
I think the important thing is that you always have the next thing in mind.
You don’t let yourself stop completely.
There should always be something in the rotation that you’re working toward.
From the time I released my first song, that was kind of the goal.
I had all these songs, and I just kept trying to finish them one by one.
Then once one was done, I’d do what I needed to do to get it out, and then move on to the next one.
As you keep doing it, you get better at the process.
You learn what you need to do, you learn what works, you learn what doesn’t.
Sometimes it’s as simple as telling a friend,
“Hey, on Tuesday we’re going to go out with a camera and a speaker and just film something so I can post the song.”
It doesn’t have to be complicated, but when you overthink it, it feels complicated.
I’m a huge overthinker, so every release can feel intimidating.
But then once it’s done, you realize it wasn’t that bad.
And I think the key with consistency is that once you finish something,
it’s really tempting to be like, okay, I did it, I’m done for a while.
But that’s when you need to get back on the saddle and start the next thing.
This year I’m finally getting to a place where when one song comes out, the next one is already in motion.
And that makes you feel more confident, more connected to what you’re doing.
It’s a lot of work, but it also makes you feel like,
okay… I’m actually doing this.
And the motivation is always that the next song could be the one that changes everything.
So I just want to keep putting things out and see what happens.
Mike:
When you do feel overwhelmed or intimidated, I’d like to talk about that a little more.
When you feel that way, what do you do?
Do you take a break?
Do you push through it?
How do you deal with that?
Leah:
It depends.
Especially now with social media, you’re constantly seeing everyone else’s accomplishments.
You release something, and then immediately you see someone else doing something bigger.
And it’s so easy to think,
“Oh, I don’t have that yet,”
or
“I’m behind.”
So one thing I do is unplug.
Even if I post something, I’ll tell myself,
Okay, I’m not going to look at my phone for a few hours.
Just go exist.
Be proud of what you did.
That’s something I really try to remind myself —
every step counts.
Even finishing a song is an accomplishment.
When you’re chasing a big goal, you forget that every small thing is progress.
So I try to talk to myself positively.
And also remind myself that you can only do so much every day.
As long as you did something you’re proud of, that’s enough.
That’s going to add up over time.
Mike:
I totally agree with that.
Taking breaks is so important.
Going outside, going for a walk, doing something that has nothing to do with music or social media.
Just being in the moment.
I can’t stress that enough, because I know for myself there are days where I don’t want to do anything.
And that’s normal.
Leah:
Yeah, and that’s the balance that’s really hard to find.
You want to stay motivated and working,
but you don’t want it to take over your whole life.
I’ve gone back and forth on that so many times.
You need times where you’re grinding,
and times where you let yourself relax.
And finding that balance is really hard, especially when you’re basically running your own business.
Mike:
You are running your own business.
Every artist is an entrepreneur, whether they want to admit it or not.
Leah:
Totally.
And sometimes life just happens.
Sometimes you need to make money that month.
Sometimes you don’t have time for music.
I’ve had months where I didn’t do anything for the next release, and then suddenly I realize,
Oh no, I need to get back into this.
And that’s normal.
I think what really matters is that you come back to it.
If you fall off for a while but then get back into the routine,
that shows you really want this.
And I’m finally getting to a place where music feels like a natural part of my life, not something I’m forcing.
I can find pockets of time for it.
I can also find time to take a break.
And I think letting go of the idea that you have to be perfect every day helps a lot.
Instead of saying,
“I have to do this, I have to do that,”
I try to say,
“I want to do this.”
That mindset makes me more productive than being super strict with myself.
Mike:
I love that.
And I also like the idea that productivity isn’t the same every day.
People think productivity means being at 100% every day, but that’s not real.
Real productivity goes up and down.
Some days you’re at 80%, some days you’re at 10%, some days you’re at 50%.
And that’s normal human behavior.
When you’re not at your peak, it’s okay to do something else.
Maybe you clean, maybe you organize, maybe you cook, maybe you go for a walk.
You don’t always have to be in high-level creative mode.
Leah:
Exactly.
Sometimes I’ll just make a nice meal.
Sometimes I’ll clean.
And honestly, sometimes you just need to do that.
And also, sometimes you have to focus on other things, like work, money, life stuff.
And then two months go by and you realize you haven’t worked on music.
That happens.
The important part is getting back into it,
and still having a healthy relationship with it.
Because if you hate it, you’re not going to keep doing it.
And I think I’m finally getting to a place where I can keep music in my routine without it stressing me out.
It’s still scary sometimes, but I try to remind myself,
You’re doing this because you want to.
And I think cheerleading yourself is one of the best things you can do.
Mike:
Absolutely.
Alright, I do want to switch gears a little bit and talk about your latest single, Quicksand,
because I really love this song.
What was different about this release compared to your previous ones?
Yeah, so Quicksand felt a little different from my other releases because I feel like I’ve gotten more comfortable with my sound.
With earlier songs, I was still figuring out what I wanted things to sound like, what kind of production I liked, what kind of writing I liked.
With this one, I felt more confident going into it.
I had a clearer idea of the feeling I wanted, and I trusted myself more.
The song itself came from that feeling of being stuck in your head.
Like when you know you should move forward or make a decision, but you keep overthinking everything, and the more you think about it, the more stuck you feel.
That’s where the title Quicksand came from.
It’s that feeling where the more you struggle, the more trapped you get.
And I think that’s something a lot of people can relate to, especially creatively.
You want to do something, but you get in your own way.
Mike:
That’s one of the reasons I connected with the song so much, because that feeling is so real.
I think anyone doing something creative has felt that at some point.
Was this one written quickly, or was this one of the songs that took a long time to finish?
Leah:
It actually came together pretty quickly compared to some of my other songs.
The main idea happened in one sitting, and then I went back and refined it over time.
That seems to be how a lot of my songs go.
I get the core idea pretty fast, and then I spend a while shaping it, changing things, rewriting parts, figuring out the production.
But the feeling behind the song was there right away.
Mike:
And now you’re working toward an EP, right?
Leah:
Yes.
That’s the goal right now.
I’ve been releasing singles, and I like that, but I also want to put together a full body of work that feels connected.
An EP feels like the right next step.
It gives you more space to tell a story, more space to show different sides of your sound.
And I think after releasing singles for a while, it feels exciting to work toward something bigger.
Mike:
Do you approach writing differently when you know it’s going to be part of a bigger project instead of just one song?
Leah:
A little bit.
I still write songs the same way, but when I’m thinking about an EP, I start noticing which songs feel like they belong together.
Sometimes I’ll write something and realize,
okay, this fits with this other song, these feel like they’re part of the same world.
And that helps guide the direction.
It’s not like I sit down and say,
“I’m going to write a song for the EP today,”
but over time you see the connections.
Mike:
I also saw that you’ve done some Sofar shows.
Those are always interesting because they’re such a different environment compared to a normal show.
What has that experience been like?
Leah:
I love Sofar shows.
They’re really special because people are actually there to listen.
It’s not like a bar where people are talking or on their phones.
Everyone is sitting, paying attention, and focused on the music.
It makes you perform differently.
You feel more vulnerable, but also more connected.
And I think those kinds of shows are really good for songs that are more storytelling-based, because people are actually hearing the lyrics.
Mike:
That makes sense.
It’s almost like a listening room environment instead of a typical concert.
Leah:
Exactly.
And as a songwriter, that’s really rewarding.
You feel like people are actually hearing what you wrote.
Mike:
Before we wrap up, I always like to ask this question.
For someone listening right now who wants to release music, wants to be an artist, wants to do what you’re doing,
what advice would you give them?
Leah:
I would say…
If you have that bug, and you want to go for it, just go for it.
Don’t wait until everything is perfect.
Don’t wait until you feel ready.
You learn what to do by doing it.
And also, don’t forget to have fun with it.
It’s really easy to get caught up in numbers and expectations and what everyone else is doing.
But at the end of the day, if you don’t enjoy making music, you’re not going to keep doing it.
So keep creating, keep putting things out, keep learning,
and try to enjoy the process as much as you can.
Mike:
I love that.
And honestly, that’s a perfect place to end, because that’s exactly what this show is about.
Just keep creating, keep learning, keep moving forward.
Thank you so much for being on the show, I really appreciate it.
Leah:
Thank you so much for having me.
Mike:
Absolutely.
And for everyone listening, make sure to check out Leah Nawy, check out the single Quicksand,
and keep an eye out for the upcoming EP.
Thanks for listening, and we’ll see you next time.